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German Unity Day and American Secessionists Meeting

Today Germans celebrate the 17th anniversary of the unification of East and West Germany. At the same time, some US liberal and conservative fringe groups meet in Tennessee to work on secession from the United States of America, reports Yahoo! News:
In an unlikely marriage of desire to secede from the United States, two advocacy groups from opposite political traditions New England and the South are sitting down to talk. Tired of foreign wars and what they consider right-wing courts, the Middlebury Institute wants liberal states like Vermont to be able to secede peacefully. That sounds just fine to the League of the South, a conservative group that refuses to give up on Southern independence. (...)
If allowed to go their own way, New Englanders "probably would allow abortion and have gun control," Hill said, while Southerners "would probably crack down on illegal immigration harder than it is being now."
The U.S. Constitution does not explicitly prohibit secession, but few people think it is politically viable. Vermont, one of the nation's most liberal states, has become a hotbed for liberal secessionists, a fringe movement that gained new traction because of the Iraq war, rising oil prices and the formation of several pro-secession groups.
Last year the Atlantic Review wrote about Germany's Unity Day, patriotism, Anti-Americanism and the importance of soccer, with funny videos: Germany's National Holiday and the "Summer's Tale" Documentary

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Pat Patterson on :

And what usually happens is that these groups realize that they will have to put the whole fantasy to a vote. And also that the block grants, agricultural subsidies and quota payments will end, mother's milk to these usually impoverished states. Soon there is a murmur and a gathering roar of shuffling feet and someone in the back of the room mumbles aloud, "Nevermind!"

Joerg - Atlantic Review on :

What a shame. I thought all these constant quarrels between red and blue America would end tomorrow ;-)

SC on :

Maybe that day is at hand, Joerg. These groups seem to have found an issue they can agree upon. That must make them "uniters" and not "dividers", eh? ;-)

Reid of America on :

Only Texas can seceed from the USA without approval of three-fourths of the states. One of the conditions of the Republic of Texas joing the USA in 1845 was the right to seceed without permission. The article implies that the nation of Vermont would have strong gun control laws. This is pure ignorance. Vermont has the least gun control in the USA. Any law abiding adult can purchase and concealed carry a pistol without a license or permission. Even Bernie Sanders the socialist Vermont Senator has stated that he would have no chance of re-election if he advocated gun control. Both left and right in Vermont are pro-gun. The fact that Vermont is the most rural state in the USA is a prime reason. Vermont also has the lowest violent crime rate in the USA and is the whitest state. Secession of Vermont or any other state except Texas is a virtual impossibility at the present time.

David on :

"Vermont also has the lowest violent crime rate in the USA" Good point. And Vermont also abolished the death penalty in 1964.

Pat Patterson on :

And the current champion city for murders is Detroit which has laws requiring permits of handguns and a state wide ban on he death penalty. I also should mention that the most violent area is the Commonwealth of Puerto Rico which has strict rules on gun possesion and also has no death penalty.

David on :

Texas still leads all states in murder -- and executes more prisoners than any other state. There is absolutely NO empirical evidence that capital punishment acts as a deterrent.

Pat Patterson on :

California leads the nation in number of murders at 2,503 while Texas with almost a similar population is not even close at 1,407 with Florida, retirees more likely to be murdered than doing the murders, closing fast with 1,129 murders. The highest per capita murder rates by state, territory or Federal district are DC, Puerto Rico, Lousiana, Maryland and Nevada. One chart can easily dispel the idea that the death penalty hasn't had any effect on murder rates. A simple graph prepared by the Bureau of Criminal Justice shows clearly that the murder rate skyrocketed after the Supreme Court stopped all executions in 1972 and then began a drop, not as dramatic as the rise, in the number of murders in 1992 when the Court allowed states to begin executing for capital offenses again. [url]http://www.benbest.com/lifeext/execute.jpg[/url]

Pat Patterson on :

The joint resolution accepting Texas to the United States makes absolutely no mention of Texas retaining the power of seccession. Rather it made for the provision that Texas might, in the future, divide itself and any new territory acquired(that area eventually known as the Gadsen Purchase)) into four parts. Maybe the confusion arises because Texas had successfully seceded from the Republic of Mexico though obviously Mexico never accepted that state of affairs until forced to do so via the Treaty of Guadalupe-Hidalgo in 1848. [url]http://www.tsl.state.tx.us/ref/abouttx/annexation/march1845.html[/url]

Reid of America on :

I stand corrected. My info came from a History Channel documentary on the states. Many people are unaware that the US conquered Mexico in 1845. US troops under Zachary Taylor's command took control of Mexico City and the seat of power. The US Congress decided not to annex all of Mexico but only take lands north of the Rio Grande. Not keeping all of Mexico in 1845 was one of the biggest mistakes in US history. That and ceeding Canada to the British and French earlier were big mistakes.

Pat Patterson on :

I've noticed that the History Channel has been somewhat shakey on the facts but also that most of these mistakes come from programs and documentaries the have been provided by either independent and foreign producers. The former should know better and the latter most often just made a mistake.

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