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Brussels Forum

In just three years, the Brussels Forum has established itself as an elite annual conference for the key players in transatlantic relations. The Brussels Forum is what Davos is for the business elite and the Munich Security Conference for the defense politicians.

Steve Clemons was impressed by this year's Brussels Forum from March 14-16. Dan Drezner has posted some good gossip and written something more serious for Newsweek.

Constanze Stelzenmüller of the German Marshall Fund, the main organizer of the Brussels Forum, presented an interesting sounding paper: "America and Europe, seven years after 9/11: Hard power humbled, soft power exposed, and a looser, more pragmatic relationship," available for download as a PDF.

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Merkel-2 on :

Since business elites and security experts will attend this meeting . I hope they will study the economic criss triggered by US government blunders. US shouldn't devaluate its currency on its own benefits.US should not overcome the recent crisis with the expense of World economy's stagnation and other country's exchange loss . That's immoral and irresponsible. As to the Munich Security Conference , I hope the defense politicians tone down their hawkish words in ideology . They should eradicate the soil which fertilize the hatred and enmity. I take a dim view on the anti-terrorist war launched by Western world. It emphasize so much on the violence and revengence, sometimes ideology , religious and racism discrimination possess major parts of them. How can these highed biased propaganda (from Western media ) convince islamic world , Red China , Russia that there exist no western world's evil plot .

Joe Noory on :

The western media can't and shouldn't convince anyone worldwide of anything - they aren't a state-run propaganda operation, at least ours aren't. As for all that "yucky" war, the fact that defense officials are hawkish is something you actually WANT, as long as they're under civil control. Look - if the IMAGERY bothers you, change the channel, but don't pretend that people who attacked all of US will stop because you pretend they aren't there. We need to fight the small wars we're fighting now to terminate the immediate threats, and necotiate from a position of strength. If you think a soft and reticent image will help that, good for you - I don't plan on helping you get the rest of us killed.

Merkel-3 on :

original Post from Merkel How can these highly biased propaganda (from Western media ) convince islamic world , Red China , Russia that there exist no western world's evil plot . reply from Joe Noory: The western media can't and shouldn't convince anyone worldwide of anything - they aren't a state-run propaganda operation, at least ours aren't. comment: Generally speaking, western media is not state-run meida. But all of them have its inclination . Most of time their position affected by their sponsers and supporters. for example Washington Post is pro-Republican and NY Times give more assent to Democratic party. As to most of profit-targeted media there is no fair at all . I can be sure even the main-stream media like FOX ,CNN BBC they have fierce competition for popularity then eventually profits. When western media think something challenge US and its alliance's interests , they can unite and lash out fire on their enemies. That is the way they safeguard their belief. I respect western media 's passion to safeguard their belief,their culture and civilization, but totally object western media 's disinformation campaign on its "enemies". "Using immoral way to accomplish their moral goal" , does this sounds absurd? western media 's coverages on Iraq and Lhasa(Tibet) is a mess and is a shame as well. CNN cropped the picture to fit their one-sided reports, CNN also cropped its conscience for truth-seeking.

Merkel-3 on :

JOE: As for all that "yucky" war, the fact that defense officials are hawkish is something you actually WANT, as long as they're under civil control. comment: Pentagon's hawkish words will spark counter reaction from its enemies. The counter reaction will be exaggerated by highly biased western media as the fresh evidences supporting Pentagon officials security concerns. Pentagon officials is good at fabricating imminent and grave threats in domestic and international shpere. That will validate its astonishing budget and promote its weapon sale. Joe: Look - if the IMAGERY bothers you, change the channel, but don't pretend that people who attacked all of US will stop because you pretend they aren't there. We need to fight the small wars we're fighting now to terminate the immediate threats, and necotiate from a position of strength. If you think a soft and reticent image will help that, good for you - I don't plan on helping you get the rest of us killed. comment: Western media have great influnce over the world. partly because its colonization and cultrue suppression, India is very good examples , during its thousands of years of evolvement, Hindu language posses the overwhelming edge to other dialect(s) in Hindustan, When British colonized the country , English is the official language .Even after India independence, Hindu elites also intoxicated by their English capability which will distinguish them from grass roots. Maybe that is a progress comparing to India's Caste System worshiping. The same thing happened in Africa,Latin America, South-east Asia...,Western world take great edge in its propaganda. It's not so easy for me to accept such hegemony in news coverages. "Change the channel" will not solve CNN and BBC's distorted coverages. Joe, i didn't pretend there is no "terrorists" lurking somewhere attempting to attack Western world. I just want you know the current US government's policy for absolute security without considering other countries' security concerns is not helpful. The best way to enhance US and its alliance security is : 1.Set up a multi-party's dailogue, 2.stop evil axis B'shits . 3.Make written guarantee to convince North Korea and Iran there is no need to develop A-bomb. 4.Respect islamic world and convince them that western world will not challenge their religion belief and their civilization. request them not supporting terrorists in return. I know hawkish hardliner is more populous in western world.But their efforts make the whole thing complicated. That's why I think "it is not clear the Munich Security Conference will make things worse or better?"

Pat Patterson on :

A little fact checking might be in order as the Washington Post has not been considered a "Republican" paper since 1968 during the first Nixon Administration. Since then it has generally skirted around it no endorsement policy, until 2004 and John Kerry, and merely recommended certain candidates, ie., Bill Clinton, Al Gore and John Kerry. And unless someone has a stroke when writing the endorsement editorial I suspect it will be the Democratic candidate. Why not learn English, my ancestors had to just three generations ago because they didn't want to stay isolated from the world or get stuck digging coal for the next century or so. Pride in culture and place are important but if the US is your largest export market then you better learn English quick. All the better to issue pitying threats of trade retaliation for putting lead in toys. [url]http://www1.pressdemocrat.com/article/20070824/NEWS/708240355/1036/BUSINESS01[/url]

Henson_MKL on :

original post: for example Washington Post is pro-Republican and NY Times give more assent to Democratic party. Distorted to : Pat Patterson - #4 - 2008-04-03 05:27 - (Reply) A little fact checking might be in order as the Washington Post has not been considered a "Republican" paper since 1968 during the first Nixon Administration. Comment: [Washington Post is considered as a "Republican" paper ] This is my point? Sorry leave you such misunderstanding. Which mainstream western media openly label itself as Democratic or Republican mouthpiece. you had exaggerate my posts in a very appropriate way. I think your "fact checking" is good attitude but miss the traget. it fight totally against your imagination on my posts All media have its inclination. there are millions of facts to prove Washington Post is pro-Republican conservative. Your evidences seems week. frankly speaking , I have no interests in such meaningless arguing (esp NY Times or Washington Post's inclination).

Pat Patterson on :

I guess it is confusing when the comment states that "...for example Washington Post is pro-Republican..." doesn't really mean that and its all just a silly misunderstanding. But I will rephrase might comment in that the Washington Post has not been considered a pro-Republican paper since at least 1968 and even earlier. If you truly have no desire for "...meaningless arguing," then perhaps not continually making meaningless factual and logical errors would eliminate that problem. That and using the same pseudonym for identity and consistency. The rest seems to be the result of censored pablum and the feverish imaginings of teenagers in chat rooms.

MKL-4 on :

Cold war come to an end. But Cold war mindset still exists in western media and its believer. Western media stick by its ideology and always distorted truth to express their fidelity to their belief. For example Britain media cook data to make public believe that Sadam regime sponsor AI-Queda and is developing nuclear bomb. Britain media (Reuter) spread misinformation on Lhasa riots, Britain media ("Independent" newspaper) fake IOC President Jacques Rogge 's signature to bycott BeiJing Olympic. Britain media (london-based "telegraph") makes another lie "China reveals Iran's nuclear secrets to UN“ , it proclaim that its source is from IAEA diploamt. But the whole coverages is confirmed as anything but a lie by Chinese government and IAEA institution as well. China had request IAEA body to investigate the false coverage is from Telegraph's paranoid or some IAEA officials . China representative in Geneva unofficially disclose that China want the IAEA to be more cautiously to reevaluate those evidences provide by UK government. The 3rd sanction was promulgated based on these. If UK government make lie again as it did in Iraq war,will the whole world experience another HR disaster like iraq? China does not object the sanction upon Iran if it do embrace nuclear bomb. China should be alert someone using fake evidences to reach its despicable goals. Liar's linkage: www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2008/04/02/wiran102.xml - 49k

MKL -2 on :

Cold war is also an ideology war . In that special circumstance, there is no crystal clear moral criterion. A dictator can be acceptable to Western world if he is against Communists. His atrocity on its people will not blur its glory. At least in Ronald Reagon and Margaret Thatcher mind , General pinochet and CENTRAL AFRICA "Cannibal" Emperor Jean-Bedel Bokassa and Congo's tyrant Mobutu Sese Seko are definitely agreeable than communist dictators. Cold war make many things distorted. Ideology fidelity became the major points to validate western media's ideology war. They can eulogize Saudi Arabia royal's steadfastness against communnist , embrace the most cruel lord-cerf institution and theocracy system in Tibet. Look at western media's nowadays disinformation campaign, Their charges on March 14 's crack-down totally based on false information.

MKL-3 on :

Napel and india police who are in charge of Chinese embassy had to disperse those tibetan "peace" demonstators. They wanna peacefully intrude into Chinese embassy and peacefully fire China's national flags. Napel and india police never use excessive violence to these demonstator as what Happened in G8 meeting in Heiligendamm, Germany . But it still leads to uproar from US and France sponsored HR groups. I can understand the awkardnees such HR groups encountered, they had to shift their vision outside HR disasters in IRAQ, Cuba Guantanamo prison for their humble survival. Republican conservative will not support HR groups which strictly criticize US crimes. HR issue became another tool to exert western world's impacts. We can check WWW.ANTI-CNN.COM and find such HR groups' dirty tricks. Their misinformation result in most of mainistream western media lost its credibility in Tibet riot coverages. I highly doubt that Washington Post and Fox news can convince its readers and TV-watchers that their mistakes by using Napel and india 's confrontation(between Tibetan and Police) to charge China March 14 's crack-down. AFTER March 14 's violent riots in Lhasa ,China police and paramilitary force do get involve in maitaining the social order and arresting those thugs. Many participants was detained , when their identification is confirmed to be not horrible crime related, they will be released as soon as possible. China government will not play the tune of western world to further escalate the stress between Han Chinese and Tibet Chinese people.

Pat Patterson on :

I sense some unease in the Middle Kingdom! It must have something to do with the referendum that Tibet had in 1951 when the Tibetans they begged to become vassals of the PRC and have their language and religion suppressed. At least when the Austrians surrendered their independence they got to wear the really stylish uniforms and eventually have on of their own lead the UN. What did the Tibetans get...?

Mkl-6 on :

I had response your post concerning india and China border war in 1962 (with the user account "USER001") . India and China sovereign disputes over a patch of tibet land is another legacy of British colonization. Tibet have many clanes in history. nowadays Tibet 14th Dalai lama got its power from the tradtion. well,Chinese central government's authorization is part of them). The 1st Dalai lama is a Mongolian person under Chinese Yuan Dynasty. Dalai lama got its prominent status during 5th Dalai lama . With Mongolian strength supports and Qing dynasty 's authorization, the Dalai and Panchan lama got their unshakable power In tibet area. Dalai lama 's inauguration ceremony was held with the supervision of ROC government officials(ROC begins in 1911 AD who claim the whole china as its sovereign and now only Taiwan practically is under its control ). ROC respect Tibet theocracy and lord-serf system. And most important they are bulwark against communist China, So there is no big problem to western world. I don't remember any country officially recognize Tibet independence even British India itself. When Korea War erupted , Washington find the "gold mine" in Tibet (A religion bulwark to Communist China). PRC China oust ROC strength out of mainland china in 1949, Red China government negotiate with Dala and Tibet local government. It's a pity Tibet local authority had no choice to select between ROC and PRC. At that time(1950s) Red China is moved by its ideology and hardly tolerate religious strength to interfere politics and lord-serf system exists for long time. But in 1950 agreement between Tibet local goverenment and PRC central government, Dalai lama and Tibet ruling class was carefully taken cared of. Red China guarantee land reform in other areas will not be implemented in Tibet area for the time being. Red China military force (PLA) entered into this land peacefully without any significant rebels. I don't know the so-called referendum is performed by whom. Almost 70% Tibeten people were serf(s) deprived of the basic human rights. I doubt it do happened . Since you provide such information . Red China on its behalf will not allow this happen. If Tibet royal carry out this action ,China will immediately give up its pledges of no land-reform. Since 14th Dalai lama eulogize comrade Mao Zedong in late 1958, and earn official support , I believe there is no significant conflict between Dalai Lama and Mao's government.

MKL-2 on :

The said "referendum" is Britain's another lie.Would you please inform me how many people get involve in the referendum, How many Tibetan people exist in 1951 ? How those tibetan people cross the vast lands(almost one third of Europe ) to Lhasa to exert their rights as slaves ,serf(s). considering the vast obstacles conserning the harsh weather and unconquerable mountaines, I doubt there do exist a referendum. I would rather regard the "referendum" as a propaganda by western media. Some tibetan royal ,aristocrats can not stand with the deprivation of their priviledges and held a small-scale action. Such a farce even not earn dalai lama and Tibet local government's approval and supports in 1951(I logically concludes here) I know I joke Britain made in its colonized Hong Kong. When Red China plan to regain Hong Kong sovereign, Britain local authority sponsor some HongKong Chinese people to call for referendum on Hong Kong and democarcy. What a controversy! Britain rule Hong Kong more than 150 years and monolize almost all the resources. Hong kong is a good legal system (inherited from Britain) but a pethetic democracy. In colonial HK government, Chinese people can not take important postion in the government, Their freedom to express their will was highly restricted. They were coerced to show their loyalty to THE QUEEN. Now this bunch of people think it is time for them to pop up to strive for democracy. I got no problem with people embracing freedom and democracy , but i disagree with such people using freedom and democracy as tool to gain their own benfits. Their fate in Hongkong politic is really pathetic.

Merkel-2 on :

In China we were encouraged to draw strength and inspiration from history. China government always eulogize its own part in China's progress in a inappropriate way. I personally disbelieve those stuff. But I do evolve a kind of patriotic feeling. Western media call it communist propaganda. I don't think so. Any Chinese people experience or read those history will became a patriot (nationalist in western media). I do think Britian's crime like colonization,opium trade ,ensalving Chinese and trafficing them into north America is forgivable. How can they blame Chinese people play victims when their looting ,trophy from China is still exhibitting in their museum. Reuter and BBC 's highly biased coverages on Lhasa riots spark great fire in China. Chinese government intentionally water down grass roots anti british feeling. If we can feely express my disgust on Britain's hypocrisy, if I can stone UK embassy and fire its flag emboding colonization, you bet I will do it. Since China is skyrocketly developing and Britain lingering around abysm, I guess one day Chinese people will have the power to let the world know what Britain did in early 20 century and how they escape moral charges. At this time western media possess overwhelming edge. My son was educated as a patriot instead of a communist believer. I don't know is it better for Britain. I told him China needn't to recapture those things stolen by colonial British by violence, China and Chinese people should use every opportunity to humiliate the old colonizing state. People who gathered at www.ANTI-CNN.com are basically pro-democacry people. Given that they will not tolerate britain's lies against Chinese people. To these people they distinguish themselves from communist government, when Reuter and BBC spread racist rummor and hatred between Han Chinese people and other ethnic chinese people. they became the most steadfastness to China government's current policy in Tibet. Hatred rooted in some tibetan people (thanks to CIA and British government decades of support) , The hatred will definitely burried in native chinese people. Good luck for Britain's hatred spreading .

Pat Patterson on :

Satire is obviously lost here as there was no referendum merely a seizure then an Orwellian rewriting of history. History does indeed inform but only if that history can be checked and verified not something simply memorized from carefully planned and often changed lesson plans. Interesting, what natural resources did Hong Kong have apart from an excellent harbor and hundreds of thousands of Chinese, Vietnamese and Cambodians that did not want to be Communists or live in a country ruled by Communists or their descendents. Plus the reasoning that Tibet became part of China because China had been conquered by the Mongols is a bit of a stretch. Especially as Tibet had been independent with its own royal lineage for centuries before Kublai Khan was even a gleam in his father's eye. The Yuan Dynasty was finished well before the posthumously recognized First Dalai Lama was born in 1391. The first Tibetan spoken of as the Dalai Lama was Sonam Gyatso by one of the Mongolian Khans in 1578. And that identification is arguably a misunderstanding of the meaning of the family name of Sonam Gyatso.

Merkel-2 on :

original POst from Paterson: Satire is obviously lost here as there was no referendum merely a seizure then an Orwellian rewriting of history. History does indeed inform but only if that history can be checked and verified not something simply memorized from carefully planned and often changed lesson plans. comment Still No clue , is there a referendum in 1951? By whom ? Which coutry officially support Tibet's independence. I know CIA always cast its shadow there , CIA promote Tibet Independence secretly never openly regonize Tibet's independence. original POst from Paterson: Interesting, what natural resources did Hong Kong have apart from an excellent harbor and hundreds of thousands of Chinese, Vietnamese and Cambodians that did not want to be Communists or live in a country ruled by Communists or their descendents. comment Pay attention to my word "resources", when you put adjective "natural" , you narrow the word's ("resources") scope. for example Human Resources is an important wealth. Hong kong 's treasures is another kind of resources. I need to remind you UK government levy tax on Hong kong people as they did in all colonial states. In my former posts I use the word "resources" , I mainly refer to this fact That high profile officials were all dispatched from London and Hong kong Chinese people have no share in HK government.Paterson , I don't deny that a large number of the low-level officials in HK government are HK Chinese. original POst from Paterson: Plus the reasoning that Tibet became part of China because China had been conquered by the Mongols is a bit of a stretch. Especially as Tibet had been independent with its own royal lineage for centuries before Kublai Khan was even a gleam in his father's eye. The Yuan Dynasty was finished well before the posthumously recognized First Dalai Lama was born in 1391. The first Tibetan spoken of as the Dalai Lama was Sonam Gyatso by one of the Mongolian Khans in 1578. And that identification is arguably a misunderstanding of the meaning of the family name of Sonam Gyatso. Comment Mongols conquered historical "China",Capital Beijing. Then Han Chinese people assimilate the nomadic tribe , the Mongol became part of historical "China" until early 20 century. part of Mongol became an independent state. Ming Dynasty take the place of Yuan Dynasty, Tibet as part of it lasts for hundreds of years. Manchu aristocrat conquer "China" , Chinese lifestyle errod the ruler of Manchu, they were assimilated to Chinese also. In todays China there is no big difference between Han Chinese and Manchu Chinese. Under Manchu's Qing Dynasty Tibet is also part of China. Then republic of China(1911 AD), Tibet stay in China family. China's Civil war between Nationalist party and communist party weaken the central government's control over Tibet. But Tibet never cut off umbilical cord with its motherland. No country officially support Tibet's independence so Dalai lama and its local government had to reach an agreement with red China.Dalai lama and Tibet ruling class had surrendered to PLA in 1950. There is no large scale bloody battle happened in Lhasa in 1950. Tibetan people got its lawful rights to decide its own affairs as the other 55 ethnic people in China did. But it does not lead to sepeartion of China. At this time Chinese people can not accept western world drived sepeartion. They want to dismember China for more than 200 years. China can not afford giving another chance to western world. With the development of freedom and democracy , China will provide more space more privacy to all its people (including Tibet Chinese).At that time ,Tibetan autonomy will be more substantial. If Tibet experience such stage and still want independence , I guess Chinese people can be more understanding than they are. You got to recognize china have more lawful rights to claim Tibet's sovereign than US claim North America , UK claim on Falkland Islands, Australia cliam against Australian aborigines. Canada didn't repect Quebec independence claim for decades and it want to teach China a lesson.Since hypocrisy prevails in western world, China need not echo those HR groups' requests. CHina can negotiate with such dirty HR groups sponsor to make a deal. openness like Gorbachev will not bring in good future to China. Politic has its way to run.Dirty politicians and paranoid media never end their filthy game. They will exagerrate China communist's once blunders("crime") in cultrue revolution as proof to abet racist clashes. We chinese people all know that tragedy is against all chinese people not specially targeting Tibetan Chinese. All ethnic people In China are equally treated (actually they take advantages to Han Chinese people in many way) because of minority people policy. Tibetan Children , mongolia Children like other ethnic people's Children can receive free-of-charge education using their own language(minority people language). Western media 's biased coverage will not reach its goal there.

MKL-2 on :

Be careful in phrasing so that no misunderstanding by Paterson. "monopolize" What a controversy! Britain rule Hong Kong more than 150 years and monolize(monopolize) almost all the resources. Error I know I joke Britain made in its colonized Hong Kong. Right I know a (1) joke Britain made in its colonized Hong Kong.

Anonymous on :

Yawn...pre-literates I do think not that post should contrary to orders on website; happy double-bubble disco okay :))) Pat is tool that even arable land shirks from. Will you go now?

MKL-2 on :

What is that supposed to mean? your comment get me confused here! you Yawn, may be you need a nap . You know when I am sleepy ,i can not articulate my points. sometimes I made mistake myself. So my suggestion to you is go to bed and keep your mouth shut-up . If I misunderstand you , your lingo is for Mr. Paterson instead of me. Then sorry for interruption. If you enjoy imitating others to show off your fluency in English, I had nothing to say. I guess you ("Anonymous") have other talents except your unknown ,unseen and facinating lingual-capability. Show me your wisdom,your acute mind. Not be ashamed of your introduction. As to your question [Will you go now?], if it refers to me , my answer is "no" for the time being. If the webmaster deprive my rights of sending posts, I will consider leave. Welcome you back with a meaningful presence .

Pat Patterson on :

Actually I think that comment and ensuing gibberish was directed at me. I did like the metaphor and simply because someone, unaffiliated with the four principals here, tells you to leave simply ignore them. And I don't think that Anonymous was trying to be ungrammatical and illogical I think that is his natural state. Though I didn't understand the "...happy double-bubble disco okay" either!

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